What's going to be the next big civil rights movement?

[Everlong]

This is an interesting question that a couple friends and I were discussing the other week. The early 20th century saw a big movement for women's rights. The mid-20th century saw a big movement for equal race rights. Currently we're seeing a big movement for equal rights for homosexuals, particularly with marriage.

So I guess the question is, what next? What's going to be the next big civil rights movement in America and worldwide? Is it going to be an expansion on stuff we've already seen, or will we see a new issue altogether rise to the top that currently is not getting any attention?

[Hanley!]

Transgender rights could become a hot topic in the future, though I'm not sure it'll ever become as important to the culture as gay rights, because of the smaller numbers involved. It's definitely an area where people need to be educated though, I saw some comments on WWE-Club about it in the past that made me pretty upset.

Gay rights isn't going to stop being an issue any time soon unfortunately though. The world has a long way to go in that area still.

[Everlong]

Yeah transgender rights was one that a friend of mine had mentioned, but I think we're quite a ways off from that yet, especially considering, as you said, the numbers involved. As far off as we are from having a society that's truly accepting of homosexuals, we're exponentially farther away from having one that's accepting of transpeople.

[ShaneOfan]

My guess is we will see gay marriage within the nest 10 years on a national level. Even in 5 years is likely.

As for the next one. The glass ceiling. I think we will see mandatory equal pay next.

[Everlong]

^Mandatory equal pay as in how?

[ShaneOfan]

^Mandatory equal pay as in how?

the fact that women still tend to make less for the same jobs that men do.

[Buck]

People with FAAAAT ASSES will be included in the Civil Rights Act, so that people with FAAAAAAAT ASSES will get affirmative action and stuff.



Also, equal rights for alien monsters.



Now, if I can be serious for just one minute.

^Mandatory equal pay as in how?

the fact that women still tend to make less for the same jobs that men do.

The problem is, civil rights issues like marriage equality are a lot more clear cut and obvious. The very existence of a gender wage gap for the same job is debated.

My employer, for instance, which is roughly 70% female (I work for a hospital), and my particular department which is 95% female (literally, 40 employees, 2 of which are male, myself and one other), everyone has the same starting wage. Then, you get merit increases at your yearly evaluation. Depending on the score you get on your evaluation, you get a certain percentage increase. None of these formulas are affected by the gender of the employee.

Many employers have moved to very predictable formulas for starting wage and raises (if any), in an attempt to be fair and avoid being accused of discrimination either for personal reasons or due to one of the illegal forms of discrimination like race, gender or national origin. This has had the unfortunate side effect however, of resulting in harder-working employees getting paid the same as people who slack off. Although that corrects itself eventually.

Of course, there are reasons why some people get paid more than others. If one person has more seniority, they tend to get paid more. Seniority not only means they've probably gotten more raises over the years. Someone could have stayed at the same employer for so long that the pay scales might have changed after they started, and their older, higher wages are grandfathered in (generally speaking, while you're in the same position at the same company, your wage only goes up, never down, although there are rare exceptions).

Sometimes, employers also have pay scales that take into account a person's education (the higher the education level, the higher the starting pay). People who get better evaluations probably get larger wage increases at many employers. Also, sometimes, employees are just able to negotiate better salaries, although that usually happens only at higher level positions like executives, doctors, lawyers and the like.

However, no companies out there have a blanket policy of completely separate pay scales for males and females. Like "Males start at 11.50/hour while females start at 11.25/hour". There are already laws against this.

There are a lot of reasons why one person may get paid more than another for the same job. Pinpointing and proving gender discrimination in this regard is hard if not impossible. And I can tell you this much, the government probably isn't going to go much farther than they already have. Paying someone more money because they have more seniority and more qualifications, there's nothing illegal about that and it never will be.

[Westcoastvibes]

I would say gay marriage or is the top runner for the next movement. It seems to be the hottest topic whenever the topic is discussed nationwide or even worldwide.

As a secondary option I would go for either immigration reform/rights or cannabis legalization.
Both seem to be a major topic recently. Immigration rights more so than cannabis but the legalization of cannabis movement has been spreading like a Australian bush fire after the states of Washington and Colorado legalized it for recreational use and started taxing sales. We have seen multiple states pass medical usage bills in the last couple years and many others currently submitting bills for public vote or drafting bills for future public vote. Even on a federal level the government is considering an amendment to the current drug laws that would allow states to individually control cannabis sales and taxing while still making bootlegging and unapproved farming/cultivation/sales a federal offense with certain stipulations like quantity and bootlegging across national boundaries.

Immigration reform is something that needs to be done but nobody can decide on who/what/when/how to do it. Every person of political importance to this subject has a different idea on how it should be done and none of then can agree with each other on how to even get started. Its caused issues amongst the general population because the majority of folks who live relatively close to a national border (north or south) want tighter regulations, tighter borders, more guards and more funding to protect those borders. The others that don't live by a border tend to sway opposite and want looser borders with a more streamlined and less intensive program for those who wish to come into our country. They believe that by tightening the borders and funding the defense of it better it only forces those who wish to illegally cross into more dangerous situations more likely to cause death instead of stopping them. Because the various political persons are as split on this subject just as bad as the voters it has the potential to blow up huge.

[ShaneOfan]

People with FAAAAT ASSES will be included in the Civil Rights Act, so that people with FAAAAAAAT ASSES will get affirmative action and stuff.



Also, equal rights for alien monsters.



Now, if I can be serious for just one minute.

^Mandatory equal pay as in how?

the fact that women still tend to make less for the same jobs that men do.

The problem is, civil rights issues like marriage equality are a lot more clear cut and obvious. The very existence of a gender wage gap for the same job is debated.

My employer, for instance, which is roughly 70% female (I work for a hospital), and my particular department which is 95% female (literally, 40 employees, 2 of which are male, myself and one other), everyone has the same starting wage. Then, you get merit increases at your yearly evaluation. Depending on the score you get on your evaluation, you get a certain percentage increase. None of these formulas are affected by the gender of the employee.

Many employers have moved to very predictable formulas for starting wage and raises (if any), in an attempt to be fair and avoid being accused of discrimination either for personal reasons or due to one of the illegal forms of discrimination like race, gender or national origin. This has had the unfortunate side effect however, of resulting in harder-working employees getting paid the same as people who slack off. Although that corrects itself eventually.

Of course, there are reasons why some people get paid more than others. If one person has more seniority, they tend to get paid more. Seniority not only means they've probably gotten more raises over the years. Someone could have stayed at the same employer for so long that the pay scales might have changed after they started, and their older, higher wages are grandfathered in (generally speaking, while you're in the same position at the same company, your wage only goes up, never down, although there are rare exceptions).

Sometimes, employers also have pay scales that take into account a person's education (the higher the education level, the higher the starting pay). People who get better evaluations probably get larger wage increases at many employers. Also, sometimes, employees are just able to negotiate better salaries, although that usually happens only at higher level positions like executives, doctors, lawyers and the like.

However, no companies out there have a blanket policy of completely separate pay scales for males and females. Like "Males start at 11.50/hour while females start at 11.25/hour". There are already laws against this.

There are a lot of reasons why one person may get paid more than another for the same job. Pinpointing and proving gender discrimination in this regard is hard if not impossible. And I can tell you this much, the government probably isn't going to go much farther than they already have. Paying someone more money because they have more seniority and more qualifications, there's nothing illegal about that and it never will be.

I'm sorry but if you honestly think that there is no glass ceiling in many industries just because you don't see one where you work then you are a fool. On average in America women make 77 cents to the dollar that men make and that is according to the US census bureau. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/1 ... 41180.html http://www.whitehouse.gov/equal-pay/career and this 50 years ater the equal pay act should have made this illegal. I'm sorry but it happens. There is no way it is because they are less qualified.

[Buck]

I would say gay marriage or is the top runner for the next movement. It seems to be the hottest topic whenever the topic is discussed nationwide or even worldwide.

As a secondary option I would go for either immigration reform/rights or cannabis legalization.
Both seem to be a major topic recently. Immigration rights more so than cannabis but the legalization of cannabis movement has been spreading like a Australian bush fire after the states of Washington and Colorado legalized it for recreational use and started taxing sales. We have seen multiple states pass medical usage bills in the last couple years and many others currently submitting bills for public vote or drafting bills for future public vote. Even on a federal level the government is considering an amendment to the current drug laws that would allow states to individually control cannabis sales and taxing while still making bootlegging and unapproved farming/cultivation/sales a federal offense with certain stipulations like quantity and bootlegging across national boundaries.

This is the best answer I've seen. Although I see gay marriage as the "current" movement, and cannabis is likely the "next" one. Although both movements have been around for a very long time, we're talking the next ones to really catch fire on a mainstream level. I think these are it.

Although I contend that the federal drug laws all along have been a violation of the 10th amendment, and thus they shouldn't be allowed to exist anyway. Washington and Colorado are demonstrating the principles of the 10th amendment firsthand. More power to them.

Of course the only issue with those laws is, will the feds try to interfere? Luckily, so far it seems they aren't. A rare bit of respect for the Constitution by the Obama administration!

I don't see illegal immigration as a "civil rights" issue. What I've always wondered is, what happens in ANY other country on this planet if you try to enter into it illegally? Do countries like England and Australia embrace you and give you free citizenship and welfare if you enter their countries illegally? Because that's what many expect America to do. I'm just wondering, I'm not sure what the real answer to that is.

I'm sorry but if you honestly think that there is no glass ceiling in many industries just because you don't see one where you work then you are a fool. On average in America women make 77 cents to the dollar that men make and that is according to the US census bureau. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/1 ... 41180.html http://www.whitehouse.gov/equal-pay/career and this 50 years ater the equal pay act should have made this illegal. I'm sorry but it happens. There is no way it is because they are less qualified.

If you actually read that very article, it says when you consider employees with the same qualifications doing the same jobs, that gap shrinks by 2/3. Despite the political spin of the article, it still explains itself away, no other sources needed.

Which means, according to this liberal-leaning article, 2/3 of this "wage gap" only exists because men tend to work in higher paying industries than women. But it's not like women CAN'T work in those industries, as many actually do. It's your choice which field you want to pursue your education in and look for a career in. Also, while it's challenging, it's also very possible to change careers many times over the course of your life. A lot of people do that.

Bottom line, it's the same argument we had back when we were talking about the McDonald's employees. As a person, you can make the choice to get an education and work your way into a higher paying field. If you choose not to, nobody outside of the commies in Congress and their blind followers are going to feel sorry for you. You're never too old for an education, education doesn't discriminate on race or gender, and thanks to all the government grants, subsidies and loans, you're never too poor for an education either.

Then again, the commies in Congress don't really care either, because they're only serving their own interest, trying to buy votes to stay in power. They're all millionaires anyway, and you don't see any of them voluntarily taking pay cuts to help anyone else.

Now as for that other 1/3 of the wage gap not explained by job type, education or seniority. I, for one, am willing to accept that there are other factors that the Census survey didn't think of or take into account. I don't buy the gender discrimination deal, because in a lot of employers I've had, I actually see women getting preferential treatment over males most of the time. The exception is my current employer, where I'm basically a minority being one of the only males. But in most jobs I've had, either the manager is female and she's a feminist or the manager is male and he's just nicer to females in general. I'll let your imagination decide why on that one.

[ShaneOfan]

I'm sorry but if you honestly think that there is no glass ceiling in many industries just because you don't see one where you work then you are a fool. On average in America women make 77 cents to the dollar that men make and that is according to the US census bureau. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/09/1 ... 41180.html http://www.whitehouse.gov/equal-pay/career and this 50 years ater the equal pay act should have made this illegal. I'm sorry but it happens. There is no way it is because they are less qualified.

If you actually read that very article, it says when you consider employees with the same qualifications doing the same jobs, that gap shrinks by 2/3. Despite the political spin of the article, it still explains itself away, no other sources needed.

Which means, according to this liberal-leaning article, 2/3 of this "wage gap" only exists because men tend to work in higher paying industries than women. But it's not like women CAN'T work in those industries, as many actually do. It's your choice which field you want to pursue your education in and look for a career in. Also, while it's challenging, it's also very possible to change careers many times over the course of your life. A lot of people do that.

Bottom line, it's the same argument we had back when we were talking about the McDonald's employees. As a person, you can make the choice to get an education and work your way into a higher paying field. If you choose not to, nobody outside of the commies in Congress and their blind followers are going to feel sorry for you. You're never too old for an education, education doesn't discriminate on race or gender, and thanks to all the government grants, subsidies and loans, you're never too poor for an education either.

Then again, the commies in Congress don't really care either, because they're only serving their own interest, trying to buy votes to stay in power. They're all millionaires anyway, and you don't see any of them voluntarily taking pay cuts to help anyone else.

Now as for that other 1/3 of the wage gap not explained by job type, education or seniority. I, for one, am willing to accept that there are other factors that the Census survey didn't think of or take into account. I don't buy the gender discrimination deal, because in a lot of employers I've had, I actually see women getting preferential treatment over males most of the time. The exception is my current employer, where I'm basically a minority being one of the only males. But in most jobs I've had, either the manager is female and she's a feminist or the manager is male and he's just nicer to females in general. I'll let your imagination decide why on that one.

I DID read the article and Huffington post is pretty damn reputable. I didn't say there is not more men with higher education the women. That isn't the point even if you negate the "2/3" there is still a gap that can't just be explained away. As forthe congress being "commies" that is really all I need to know about your opinions. Way to not be bias and be rational.

[SortaCreative]

How about we make sure the previous rights movements have finished and are successful before going to another?

Also - Buck - a white american male talking about a lack of glass ceiling is the best things i've read all year.

[ShaneOfan]

How about we make sure the previous rights movements have finished and are successful before going to another?

Also - Buck - a white american male talking about a lack of glass ceiling is the best things i've read all year.

I agree that we need to finish fixing things before taking on to much else. But I think that gay marriage is going to be a national thing real soon. Easily within the next ten years likely within the next five. My guess is when about half of the states allow for it, it will just become a national thing and wont matter on a state level anymore.

[Everlong]

Huffington post is pretty damn reputable.

Uhhhh...

[ShaneOfan]

Huffington post is pretty damn reputable.

Uhhhh...

I mean for factual stuff. Yes it is. For opinion pieces. Not at all.

[Westcoastvibes]

@buck -
I fully understand what you are saying and implying. I also tend to believe that the gender gap in relation to wages is primarily because men tend to work in jobs that require more skill sets or experience compared to women. If you look at fast food /retail sales and government workers, two of the major employers for the US, both of them base their employees pay rate on a entry level rate that gets elevated over time in relation to performance and longevity of the employee regardless of sex. The medical field, emergency services field and union operated fields are all the same way.

In fact, I have a hard time believing that any company out there is willing to break labor laws just so they could intentionally undercut a woman in pay. I would have to say that in most cases if a woman is getting less pay that an equal male counterpart then there is some outstanding factor that is not being divulged such as a poor performance review in the past or less seniority.

[Buck]

Also - Buck - a white american male talking about a lack of glass ceiling is the best things i've read all year.

Wow that's not racist at all.

Imagine if I had said the same thing about a black person. People would want my head on a stick. But somehow it's acceptable when the roles are reversed?

Look, buddy, it doesn't matter what color my skin is. It matters that I'm right. Good day sir.

Huffington post is pretty damn reputable.

Uhhhh...

I mean for factual stuff. Yes it is. For opinion pieces. Not at all.

Funny how it works though, when many people seem to define "fact" as something you agree with, and "opinion" as something you disagree with. The line between "fact" and "opinion" has been blurred to the point of being borderline unrecognizable, especially in today's mainstream media.

There are no "facts" that back up the notion that women get paid less BECAUSE they're women. You can say that statistics show that women make less, but there are far more factors at play than just gender.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm all for equal pay for equal work. I think the only part where we disagree is in government's role in enforcing that. I believe strongly that if you trust the government to enforce "equal pay", inevitably you'll get equal pay, which means people with better qualifications and more seniority who work harder at more difficult jobs will get paid the same as someone with less education who slacks off.

Ultimately, "equality" and "fairness" are two separate things. Ultimately, I believe it's fair that if you work harder for a longer period of time, you can earn your way to a higher wage.

This all comes down to, do you trust the government? I mean, they've certainly done a bang up job so far, right?

[ShaneOfan]

Also - Buck - a white american male talking about a lack of glass ceiling is the best things i've read all year.

Wow that's not racist at all.

Imagine if I had said the same thing about a black person. People would want my head on a stick. But somehow it's acceptable when the roles are reversed?

Look, buddy, it doesn't matter what color my skin is. It matters that I'm right. Good day sir.

Huffington post is pretty damn reputable.

Uhhhh...

I mean for factual stuff. Yes it is. For opinion pieces. Not at all.

Funny how it works though, when many people seem to define "fact" as something you agree with, and "opinion" as something you disagree with. The line between "fact" and "opinion" has been blurred to the point of being borderline unrecognizable, especially in today's mainstream media.

There are no "facts" that back up the notion that women get paid less BECAUSE they're women. You can say that statistics show that women make less, but there are far more factors at play than just gender.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm all for equal pay for equal work. I think the only part where we disagree is in government's role in enforcing that. I believe strongly that if you trust the government to enforce "equal pay", inevitably you'll get equal pay, which means people with better qualifications and more seniority who work harder at more difficult jobs will get paid the same as someone with less education who slacks off.

Ultimately, "equality" and "fairness" are two separate things. Ultimately, I believe it's fair that if you work harder for a longer period of time, you can earn your way to a higher wage.

This all comes down to, do you trust the government? I mean, they've certainly done a bang up job so far, right?

I'm not saying the government should enforce it. To be honest I'm not sure they CAN. (Not legally logistically) What I am saying is I think it WILL be a big movement in the near future.

[SortaCreative]

Also - Buck - a white american male talking about a lack of glass ceiling is the best things i've read all year.

Wow that's not racist at all.

No it's not at all.

We're talking about civil rights. Males > Females. Whites > Coloured. Westerns > Easterners. Where am I being racist?

20 years ago I may have added Straight and Christian to that too but hey, time = progression. Religion is slowly taking a back seat to Civil Rights. As will gender and colour one day. Just because you may not have a problem, doesn't mean a problem doesn't exist. Just because a problem isn't a big deal in America/Europe doesn't mean it isn't a problem any where else. Civil rights don't end at the borders of the Western World.

Edit: Also - you're looking for facts in all the wrong places. Instead of looking at hard data of pay between men and women, look at female representation in job roles in various industries to see that there is a massive, massive swing towards males. Then check out media representation of women (hey, you're online, check out the abuse females take online just because they're women). Then say there isn't a glass ceiling. That there aren't any glass walls. Your place of work is predominantly staffed by females, is that not a gender issue?

Er - how do you "end these"? Good day, sir?

[Hanley!]

I actually worked in a store years ago that was bought out and taken over by someone else half way through my term there. In the process of the change-over, it came out that the females working in the shop were getting paid less than the males working the exact same positions. So yeah, stuff like this still happens. Now that was obviously an under-the-table kind of situation that shouldn't have been happening at all, but it demonstrates that women are still regularly undervalued for the work they do.

Statistically, it's obvious that a glass ceiling still exists for women. Far fewer women than men occupy high paying executive positions, all across the Western world. I think this is a trend that will slowly decline over a number of years, but it's not a problem that we should treat as 'solved', because it's not yet.