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What's your opinion on Obama?

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What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby PorkChop » Dec 03, '13, 12:34 pm

And has it changed at all over the course of his presidency?

There was a time where all I'd hear was positive things about Obama, but now it mostly seems to be the opposite. I can't say I know much about a majority of his policies, but I'm sure as many of you know, I closely follow the NSA scandal and Obama's role in it. I can't remember the last time I heard a positive thing said about his presidency.

So I'm mostly appealing to Americans here - what's your opinion on him?
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Everlong » Dec 03, '13, 12:43 pm

I think he's been average to below average. The Affordable Care Act (aka Obamacare) has been an utter flop so far as nobody was prepared for its launch. The NSA scandal goes completely against the image of transparency upon which he based his campaigns. For a Nobel Peace Prize winner, he sure has been aggressive with drones and in dealings with LIbya. Despite running on promises of unification, the country is now more politically divided than it has been since the Civil War. While the blame for this goes beyond Obama for sure, he has had a big hand in this, making meaningless platitudes in front of the media but often refusing to compromise when it comes to actual political dealings. His plans to help the economy recover from the recession have largely failed, although that's also not something that can be totally blamed on him. In terms of international relations, he's occasionally done some great stuff but more often appears to bungle things.

On the other hand, under Obama we've had some major strides in social issues, particularly in acceptance of homosexuality and marriage rights.

So I dunno. I don't think he's as bad as most of his fiercest opponents make out, but he certainly hasn't been a "good" president. I'm glad that he's been president instead of McCain or Romney, but the only reason he's still president after his first term is because the Republicans are in shambles and are even worse than the Democrats at this point.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby AkydefGoldberg » Dec 03, '13, 3:47 pm

I can't really speak on him domestically although reading in between the lines, as Tim says, he can't do much about the economy but did bail out General Autos which was important I imagine. On Obamacare, from the outset, seems a very good idea but seems to have ballsed up in its implementation.

I judge Obama mainly on his relations with the international community and as a Muslim, because there is so much pre-occupation on the US and the Muslim World and that relationship, that's probably what I could comment on.

On that, it's been an abysmal fail. Obama gives great platitudes but he doesn't display any fairness. He was the anti-war President yet there's been more drone strikes than under his predecessor. He was quick to oust Gaddafi but was too lenient on Assad (so was the West in general) although he deserves credit for coming to agreement with Iran recently although again, so does the West in its work in that.

His image as this great champion and morally upholding President which was in the early months of his reign (speeches in Germany on nuclear proliferation is one moment I remember), has gone to tatters with drone strikes, his handling of the NSA/Snowden revelations, Wikileaks. I just think he'll go down, in my opinion, no better or worse than Bush. Alot of optimism was there for him, even from the Muslim world who wanted this guy to bring change that he banged on about yet it seemed it was the same. Stances on Israel remained the same.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Matteo » Dec 03, '13, 5:40 pm

He cops too much flack in regards to the NSA scandal. The American government was collecting data on its citizens since the Reagan administration in the 80s. The surveillance project was not implemented under Obama's reign -- he merely approved and supported it. The extent of knowledge he had is a completely different story, as well. Besides, the US government seems to spawn a very hierarchical and orderly structure, and it is obvious at this stage that Obama is not on top of the chain. Considering how the US government is fundamentally controlled and influenced by various special interest groups and corporations, I doubt Obama actually possesses the political power to discard and discontinue a program that commenced over 25 years ago and is at the core of various intelligence groups within the United States.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Westcoastvibes » Dec 03, '13, 7:47 pm

I honestly don't know why he is not dead yet, I figured within the first 6 months he would be assassinated or at least a legitimate assassination attempt.
That aside (cause it does not change my opinion on him) I think he has actually done a lot for the economy. Almost all presidential attempts to fix or change the economy in the past have not taken fruition untill the next president or two. Hell, we didn't really feel the impact from Kennedy's economic plans until Clinton's term. For what it was, we have bounced back more than we should have.
On everything else... fuck him. Obamacare is a joke, its a novel idea but the execution and terms of the act suck. A lot of people have already figured out that they are gonna pay more money for less coverage under his plan. Not to mention that it is gonna do nothing for medical care except raise rates and alienate doctors.

I know one thing for sure - Hillary Clinton 2016, and she can bring bill with her (and his cigars)
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby AkydefGoldberg » Dec 04, '13, 12:50 pm

NoDQ wrote:He cops too much flack in regards to the NSA scandal. The American government was collecting data on its citizens since the Reagan administration in the 80s. The surveillance project was not implemented under Obama's reign -- he merely approved and supported it. The extent of knowledge he had is a completely different story, as well. Besides, the US government seems to spawn a very hierarchical and orderly structure, and it is obvious at this stage that Obama is not on top of the chain. Considering how the US government is fundamentally controlled and influenced by various special interest groups and corporations, I doubt Obama actually possesses the political power to discard and discontinue a program that commenced over 25 years ago and is at the core of various intelligence groups within the United States.


I don't think people are upset at him for knowing or breaking down this system as states spy on each other - allies or not - for years. Paranoia kicks in and you want to know everything about your friends and allys.

I think people expected Obama, who was seen as someone to champion open-ness and privacy would reject this sort of snooping. Even if he'd said his disagreement on this publically just to appease folks then might have been better than to just toe the line. Some sort of minimising the snooping targets (not all of his citizens for example) might have shown some desire to change things for the better. But, guess not. He's probably abit too scared.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby blackparade » Dec 04, '13, 9:43 pm

POTUS and I were good until he became just another political puppet. I thought there'd be a chance at something different when I voted for him in 08, but other than ACA (which is massively flawed), he's done nothing to make me say he's a great President. I have made the decision in the future to vote Independent, as it seems to be the only way things might actually get done.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Viazon » Dec 04, '13, 9:58 pm

What exactly is Obamacare and why does everyone hate it so much?
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Dec 04, '13, 10:31 pm

His a puppet just like every president before him after Ronald Reagan. He has continued the genocide of Afghani civilians and Iraqi civilians, the genocide Bush started.

He is a puppet and honestly the only reason we have a black president is because they want a black person to push white America's agenda. Racism is still alive and the government is very flawed. For example; Trayvon Martin, Troy Davis, the Gaza Strip, etc.

I honestly don't pay attention to politics anymore, it's just a mechanic to turn people against each other and get them worked up over shit they can't control.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Matteo » Dec 04, '13, 11:51 pm

DanielsonTHAGOAT wrote:His a puppet just like every president before him after Ronald Reagan. He has continued the genocide of Afghani civilians and Iraqi civilians, the genocide Bush started.

He is a puppet and honestly the only reason we have a black president is because they want a black person to push white America's agenda. Racism is still alive and the government is very flawed. For example; Trayvon Martin, Troy Davis, the Gaza Strip, etc.

I honestly don't pay attention to politics anymore, it's just a mechanic to turn people against each other and get them worked up over shit they can't control.


Why do you say every President after Reagan's administration is a puppet? Do you have any evidence to support this assertion? I vaguely agree with you that the United States president is not on top of the American hierarchal political structure, but why exactly Reagan?

Also, despite the sheer horror that occurred in Iraq and Afghanistan, I would not constitute that as being part of the legally accepted term that is genocide. And what is America's white agenda? Last I checked, the world is becoming increasingly globalised, multicultural, religiously, ethnically, and culturally more diverse. It is true that there are certain individuals in perhaps every government that have a racially motivated, ideological agenda, but that doesn't necessarily make it official. I do agree racism is still prominent in the US, though.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Ali » Dec 04, '13, 11:51 pm

Meh. In my lifetime, we've had worse, we've had better. On the privacy thing, are you really surprised? The Obamacare Website deal was a huge debacle, but it'll get fixed soon enough I think. I don't blame Obama for anything so much as I blame Congress for not being willing to do anything that is outside their own individual agendas. I don't see Congress as caring all that much about what's best for the American People as a whole, so that's why the country's been so stupid recently. Plus, with cable news and the Internet being flooded with partisan bullcrap, it's hard to tell what the straight facts are. It's not like years ago when you had limited sources that were held to more of a standard of being unbiased information. Now, you can put any opinion out there without thinking and it can be called "News". It's dumb, but it's the world we live in now. As time goes on, we'll likely grow up to see a generation that's smarter about where it gets it's information, and thus, maybe a smarter and more willing political environment than we have now.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Dec 05, '13, 12:26 am

NoDQ wrote:
DanielsonTHAGOAT wrote:His a puppet just like every president before him after Ronald Reagan. He has continued the genocide of Afghani civilians and Iraqi civilians, the genocide Bush started.

He is a puppet and honestly the only reason we have a black president is because they want a black person to push white America's agenda. Racism is still alive and the government is very flawed. For example; Trayvon Martin, Troy Davis, the Gaza Strip, etc.

I honestly don't pay attention to politics anymore, it's just a mechanic to turn people against each other and get them worked up over shit they can't control.


Why do you say every President after Reagan's administration is a puppet? Do you have any evidence to support this assertion? I vaguely agree with you that the United States president is not on top of the American hierarchal political structure, but why exactly Reagan?

Also, despite the sheer horror that occurred in Iraq and Afghanistan, I would not constitute that as being part of the legally accepted term that is genocide. And what is America's white agenda? Last I checked, the world is becoming increasingly globalised, multicultural, religiously, ethnically, and culturally more diverse. It is true that there are certain individuals in perhaps every government that have a racially motivated, ideological agenda, but that doesn't neccarisly make it official. I do agree racism is still prominent in the US, though.


I think Reagan set the blueprint for everything that's going on now. For example he funded the Mujhadeen and Al Qaeda 2 to 20 BILLION dollars. Their main "mission" was to get the Soviet's out of Afghanistan however these guys were way worse than the Soviets. They destroyed religious artifacts, used religion as an excuse to take away freedom, etc. That money also helped out Osama Bin Laden as well.

In my opinion, Ronald Reagan was such a terrible president, this guy even labeled the Black Panthers as a terrorist organization. In my personal opinion I think Reagan was a terrorist himself. Let's not forget about how he distributed crack cocaine to pro dominant black neighborhoods so he can dismantle the Black Panther Party, just absolutely disgusting. He also tried to suppress them with the Mulford Act of 1967.

As far as the white agenda comment goes, it exists very heavily in mainstream news. I don't know if you watched Martin Bashir respond to Sarah Palin's comments about slavery but he voiced that her opinion was extremely racist. He was then "suggested" to resign a.k.a fired from his job. Martin Bashir gets fired because he thinks it's absurd that Sarah Palin compared debt to slavery which is stupid.

I also don't understand the point of going to war in Iraq or Syria. They say "they're trying to focus on helping those countries out" but how come we can't fix ourselves? Look at CHICAGO, how the hell do 314 soldiers die in Iraq yet 509 of them die in Chicago?

All I'm saying is we live under a very sneaky government. I don't personally have the answers for everything because I'm not too well educated in politics but quite frankly I don't think anyone has the answers to whatever is happening behind those closed doors.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby AkydefGoldberg » Dec 05, '13, 11:36 am

DanielsonTHAGOAT wrote:As far as the white agenda comment goes, it exists very heavily in mainstream news. I don't know if you watched Martin Bashir respond to Sarah Palin's comments about slavery but he voiced that her opinion was extremely racist. He was then "suggested" to resign a.k.a fired from his job. Martin Bashir gets fired because he thinks it's absurd that Sarah Palin compared debt to slavery which is stupid.


I thought he got fired for saying someone should put shit in Palin's mouth to stop her talking? That's what I read on Twitter (not a reliable source I know but vaguely just keep abreast of what happened).

Bashir's a dick anyway so not shedding tears for him.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby UTK » Dec 05, '13, 7:01 pm

Viazon wrote:What exactly is Obamacare and why does everyone hate it so much?


It's basically universal healthcare. But it's had a ton of blips in it since the moment it was passed.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Viazon » Dec 05, '13, 7:02 pm

UTK wrote:
Viazon wrote:What exactly is Obamacare and why does everyone hate it so much?


It's basically universal healthcare. But it's had a ton of blips in it since the moment it was passed.


Yeah see, that is what was confusing me. I thought Americans had always wanted better health care.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Westcoastvibes » Dec 05, '13, 9:13 pm

Viazon wrote:
UTK wrote:
Viazon wrote:What exactly is Obamacare and why does everyone hate it so much?


It's basically universal healthcare. But it's had a ton of blips in it since the moment it was passed.


Yeah see, that is what was confusing me. I thought Americans had always wanted better health care.


The problem is its not necessarily better. Americans do want better more affordable healthcare but they also want options. Obama care is the answer to affordable per say, but there is limited options. You have 3 tiers with Obama care, 70% 80% & 90% coverage, the higher the coverage the higher the price. As opposed to major insurance companies who over a variety of coverage options from different percentage to different coverage for different ailments.

Another issue is that Obama mandated that private insurance need to meet certain criteria to be considered legal coverage. A lot of people have private insurance to cover major stuff like emergency visits and surgical procedures but pay out of pocket for regular check ups and minor stuff like seeing doctor for the flu and medication. This is no longer considered to meet minimum insurance standards so they are forced to drop their coverage and sign up for Obama care at a higher price then they were paying with the private carrier.

There is a lot more but I don't have time to go threw it all, if you are interested in learning just Google "pro's & con's of obamacare"
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Racing Guy » Dec 08, '13, 4:18 pm

I had high hopes for him as President. However, it seems like we find out he lied about something every other week. I understand a politician lying isn't news though.
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Re: What's your opinion on Obama?

Postby Buck » Dec 08, '13, 9:15 pm

Westcoastvibes wrote:I honestly don't know why he is not dead yet, I figured within the first 6 months he would be assassinated or at least a legitimate assassination attempt.


The short answer is nobody gives a shit anymore. Obama's career has basically mirrored that of Miley Cyrus. He started out really popular, then people got appalled at the screwed up shit he did, and now most people really don't care. He really is just a celebrity nearing the tail-end of his career. He is a lame-duck president after all, so his relevancy is dwindling by the day.


On everything else... fuck him. Obamacare is a joke, its a novel idea but the execution and terms of the act suck. A lot of people have already figured out that they are gonna pay more money for less coverage under his plan. Not to mention that it is gonna do nothing for medical care except raise rates and alienate doctors.


I'll mostly agree with this, except you left something out. Because of Obamacare's standards for insurance coverage, a LOT of people are losing their insurance because of the law. Just in the state of Maine alone where I live, Blue Cross gave 50,000 people cancellation notices on their insurance policies, because they didn't meet Obamacare's standards. That's 50,000 more uninsured people. I thought the law was supposed to reduce the amount of uninsured people?

Obama had to actually beg the states to delay the requirements from going into effect for another year while he tries to salvage it. These people, understandably, are pissed. But they voted for the guy, so they brought it onto themselves.

I know one thing for sure - Hillary Clinton 2016, and she can bring bill with her (and his cigars)


Hillary Clinton will be 69 years old in 2016. A lot of people said Ronald Reagan was too old at 68 when he became president.

Besides, the next president will probably be a Republican, looking at the direction the country is moving right now. It took a president as popular as Reagan to get this country to vote for the same party in 3 elections in a row, and we're even more divided (and have even shorter attention spans) than we did then. Plus, the Republicans are putting up some very marketable candidates in Rubio and Christie, who will probably be the two fighting over the nomination.
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