Game of Thrones - Season 6 - Discussion Thread

[Headlesspete]

I'm in two minds on this episode, so lets get to the more negative stuff.

I hate the fact they killed of Roose. I always felt him to be one of the best villains the show ever had, an ice cold killer that never really showed emotion. I was really hoping he would go further with the show ans almost take the place of Stannis as the unrelenting force. However, whats more annoying is how he got killed off. Remember, Roose was just as big apart of the Red Wedding as the Freys, and he was the one who struck the killing blow to Rob, so i felt Roose would always get an ending that was just as gut punching and vengeful as the audience deserved, and i guess while from a stroryline point of view it was in that it was his son that delivered that blow, i didn't feel like it payed off as well as it should have.

And speaking of his son, I really don't like how much they feel the need to push Ramsey as thus psychotic lunatic. Its like they feel the need to out-do how hated Goffrey was, and this week really pushed the line of shock for the sake of shock. I get if your gonna have Ramsey kill his dad, he'll also need to kill Fat Walder and the child, but it just felt like cheap heat the way they went about it. We get it, Ramsey is evil, can we move on now?

Really enjoyed the Sansa/Brianne stuff, and the fact they brought up Arya, as its easy to forget the connections this family once had. Arya and Sansa haven't been in the same scene since Season 1, so its nice to be reminded of what they once had. And speaking of Ayra, development seems to be incoming, so looking forward to that too.

Tyrions scene with the Dragons was simply excellent. It taught us so much more of the Dragons and specifically, the "rules" so to speak the show has when it comes to how smart the Dragons are. Really enjoyable stuff that again, feels like a great starting point for the show to move forward from into a new development.

The Greyjoy stuff was decent, although i wish we'd have been given a little more time with Balon before his death. I always felt the show did a great disservice to the actor, who portrayed Balon so well, i was kinda hoping the show would delay his death for a while to allow the character more material. I worry the show will unfortunately ruin the Iron Island plot as much as they did Dorne, and that would be gutting. Hopefully Euron and Yara get some decent screentime to set up the arc they need, because if don right, it could really add a fresh feel to the whole story.

Various developments in with Bran, Tommen etc were fine. Jamie and the High Sparrows speech was riveting stuff.

And finally, what we all knew, Jon Snow is back! I actually felt the scene between Mel and Davos was brilliant. Two peaple that really hated each other for so long, working together in someway was brilliant. What i really enjoy is not just how unique and how much intrigue this adds to Jon, but also to Mel now. I think her character has to be one of the most compelling in the show, and i honestly can't wait to see what they do with her moving forward.

So yeah, Episode 1 was a reminder episode, and episode 2 was an establishing / setting up episode. I reckon next week will be where things really start to kick off.

8/10

[Everlong]

Episode 2 was definitely better than 1, that's for sure. If we'd had another episode with the same quality as 1 I'd have strongly considered giving up on the show... that's really the point I'm at with it right now.

The Jon Snow theories officially being proven true was exciting even if predictable. I'm also bummed that Roose was killed, but not particularly surprised. And yeah, really enjoying the King's Landing stuff.

Looks like we may be getting Tower of Joy next week. Awwww yiss.

[Daz]

I didn't think the first episode was all that bad, but the second was much better. Covered a lot of ground, positioned a lot of pieces, and had the nice thematic throughline of coming home etc.

All I'm really hoping for from this season is to see Jon and Sansa reunite and start plotting some Stark vengeance. They'll both probably be dead before the end now I've said that.

[Fudgecakes]

Can't wait to see Sir Arthur Dayne is action (Bran Flashback) as indicated by the trailer for Episode 3. He is pictured to be a real badass who can fight.

Also looks like the we find out if the Jon Snow theory is correct in the same scene. So juicy!

[UTK]

Like everyone else said, it was a pretty awesome episode.

But something people are neglecting: Ramsay now being the lord of House Bolton and also wanting to kill Jon basically confirms BastardBowl 2k16. Jon now being relieved of his Night's Watch vows due to the whole dying thing means Jon can do whatever he wants. Add that knowledge to the fact that they're now doing the plotline with the northern lords (probably) betraying House Bolton (instead of doing it before the battle with Stannis like in the books)......this affirms my prediction that Jon, Brienne, Sansa, and the northern houses will lead an assault on Winterfell and kill the shit out of Ramsay! GET HYPE!

[Headlesspete]

So Episode 3 very much felt like Episode 1 to me, a lot of set up followed by something big happening at the end. I won't go into it too much right now as its 3am over here and i need sleep, So I'll post my thoughts tomorrow, but a quick observation that's started to stick out.

The sheer amount of plotlines has meant the show, to me, feels like it can't build up any real momentum in each episode. No one gets much screen time, so it constantly feels a little annoying when the episode ends and everyone collectively has hardly moved from where the episode started. Maybe its always been that way and I've never noticed until now.

[prophet]

I really liked episode three which surprised me; I felt prior to the episode that the gradual build to the more epic stuff later in the season would grate on me but it didn't.

I dug the Tower of Joy fight scene with Arthur Dayne rightly being a complete badass and think they've done the right thing by not giving us that entire sequence all in one go. I don't expect to check in on Ned and Lyanna for a few weeks now. Way to go making Bran's plot line interesting, show.

The Arya montage was good. Liked that she referred back to her family and stuff and the fact they've returned her sight so early into the season is a relief as I was worried she was just going to get battered by the Waif all season long. Hopefully she'll progress further.

King's Landing is still probably the most interesting place right now. Nice scene with the High Sparrow slyly influencing Tommen; can't see Kevan or Pycelle lasting much longer. I actually can't see any of the small council surviving much longer, Olenna included.

Littlejon Umber no-selling Ramsay was hilarious. Loved his blunt Northern stubbornness in refusing to kneel for Ramsay, throwing Rickon into the mix has suddenly made Winterfell a whole lot more exciting; was shocked to see that they'd killed Shaggydog.

Dany/Mereen plot stay boring. That's her though. Don't care for Samwell but I am pumped to see his Father later on this season.

Jon is a beast; fuck Olly - I'm glad that little prick got his and I'm also glad they kept Ser Alliser true to himself up until the last, I've always liked the show's version of the character. Great ending with Jon giving Castle Black to Edd.

That's my hastily put together thoughts. I do feel going forward there's far too much going on for the show to devote the proper amount of time to. We'll see.

[Viazon]

So a lot of theories are floating around that Ned's sister Lyanna was giving birth to Jon Snow in the Tower of Joy and that he is actually his nephew rather than his bastard son. This seems to be a theory everyone is in agreement in. I had seriously never heard anything about this before. I have only just recently started watching Game of Thrones, binge watching all the episodes over Christmas and New Year. I have never really read up about the show nor am I familiar with the books. Has this always been a theory? Have they ever hinted on the show? Have I missed something.

[Hanley!]

It's always been a theory that the book readers have discussed. You have to remember that these books have been going on for a long time: GRRM takes ages to churn out a new one. That's a lot of time to speculate in between books. And nowadays when people can talk about the story at length online on Reddit and places like that, almost everyone has heard about the Tower of Joy theory.

There are a lot of reasons that it makes a lot of sense. People don't think that Ned seemed the type to have a child outside of marriage, but sullying his own name to protect someone else would certainly be in his character. There was always a certain mystery around the Tower of Joy. In the books at least, while some characters tell us that Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna, there are plenty of hints that they might have simply run away together and their relationship was legitimate. And readers noticed the language around Ned finding Lyanna in a pool of blood was vague, and that she might have just died in childbirth giving birth to Jon.

Plus if the three heads of the dragon thing is to become an important plot point later, then Jon Snow would definitely be one of them - given he'd have Targaryen blood in this scenario. It'd make him a relative of Danaerys.

There are other clues too that I'm sure I've missed; it's been a while since I've read the books and I'm not as crazy into the lore as a lot of fans anyway. It is a solid theory. And at this point, it'd actually be disappointing if it turned out not to be true. I highly doubt that will happen though.

[UTK]

Hodor

[DBSoT]

Hodor

Don't you start crying or else I am going to start..... HOLD THE DOOR....RIP

[Hanley!]

I thought this was a surprisingly bad episode. In a show with so many characters and with so little time left to get to where they're going, they should really be making better use of the show's time.

They must have spent 10 minutes on a Sam story that changed basically nothing. Was it just an excuse to get him a Valyrian steel sword? There were quicker and easier ways to do that. They also spent a lot of time on Arya even though it was obvious where they were going with this, and they could have easily reached this point a couple of episodes ago.

And on the flip side, an important moment like Benjen revealing himself to Bran was thrown away in a quick moment without any time given to it or weight put behind it.

Then the episode finished with a completely unearned epic moment for Dany (again). After 4 seasons of doing nothing, she just suddenly decided right now was the time to leave for Westeros. It felt strangely meaningless and unsatisfying after all this time. The scene came off like the writers realising that they were running out of time and that they needed to start her invasion story RIGHT NOW.

Also she gave another supervillain speech, which would be great and all, if the show didn't seem to think that she was its hero. I'm really struggling to understand why I'm supposed to be in favour of her conquest.

[Everlong]

Yeah somehow show Dany manages to be even worse than book Dany, and that's saying a whole fuckton.

[Daz]

I thought this was a surprisingly bad episode. In a show with so many characters and with so little time left to get to where they're going, they should really be making better use of the show's time.

They must have spent 10 minutes on a Sam story that changed basically nothing. Was it just an excuse to get him a Valyrian steel sword? There were quicker and easier ways to do that. They also spent a lot of time on Arya even though it was obvious where they were going with this, and they could have easily reached this point a couple of episodes ago.

And on the flip side, an important moment like Benjen revealing himself to Bran was thrown away in a quick moment without any time given to it or weight put behind it.

Then the episode finished with a completely unearned epic moment for Dany (again). After 4 seasons of doing nothing, she just suddenly decided right now was the time to leave for Westeros. It felt strangely meaningless and unsatisfying after all this time. The scene came off like the writers realising that they were running out of time and that they needed to start her invasion story RIGHT NOW.

Also she gave another supervillain speech, which would be great and all, if the show didn't seem to think that she was its hero. I'm really struggling to understand why I'm supposed to be in favour of her conquest.

Personally, I'd be totally in favour of her invasion, if not for the timing of it. The Lannister's at the minute are the most vulnerable and likeable they've ever been. Her declaration of intent to conquer came after another defeat, the fracturing of their own family, and the play Arya was watching painting a rather sympathetic portrait of Cersei.

Also, I agree with the epic moment feeling uneared. I would have preferred it if they wrapped Drogo's return and her speech into the burning of the Dothraki leaders. Would have actually been quite powerful if the dragon would have blazed in and she'd emerged from the flaming wreckage on it's back, and then gave the speech whilst everyone was watching, instead of just standing there all naked and shit.

Overall, I thought it was a decent episode. it lacked a little bit of punch but it set everything in motion for the last four episodes and had the nice thematic through line about family.

[Hanley!]

I don't see how another person wanting to interject themselves into the war can be considered a hero. All Dany wants to do is invade the kingdom with savages and dragons, killing and destroying all around her. Just so she can sit on the throne that she sees as her birthright.

She feels entitled to the throne, even though she knows her father (and brother and many other Targaeryans) was mad and completely unfit for rule. She also knows that she sucks at ruling. She's done a terrible job of it in Mereen.

If Dany gets her way, she'll completely destroy the Seven Kingdoms so she can become queen of the ashes. She'll run what's left of the society into the ground through inexperience, lack of diplomacy and lack of any kind of skill in politics at all. And then she'll die, leaving no heir to the throne, because she's barren. Which means another war of succession will kick off and plunge the Seven Kingdoms into anarchy again.

So why are we supposed to want her to do this (other than it making her story less boring)? Why would the crazy dragon lady be a better ruler for Westeros than anyone else? The only claim she has to the throne is that she's the daughter of a terrible former king. Which might be enough to convince some people within the show's world that she's a deserving ruler, but it sure as hell doesn't convince me as a viewer.

[UTK]

I quite liked the last episode, minus the Dany bit.

Benjen being the show's Coldhands is a big frikin deal and it's awesome (Coldhands has already been confirmed by GRRM to not be Benjen in the books). Benjen can now also serve as someone who can talk out R+L=J when Bran inevitably figures it out via weirwood.net.

I liked everything with Sam. They picked the perfect guy to play Randyll Tarly, and the scene went exactly as I'd expected it to go.

The most boring storyline, minus Dany, is King's Landing. I'm sick of Tommen, I'm sick of the Faith and the High Sparrow, I'm sick of pussy Jaime. Thank God Jaime is going to the Riverlands next episode. He can finally do things again.

[UTK]

I don't see how another person wanting to interject themselves into the war can be considered a hero. All Dany wants to do is invade the kingdom with savages and dragons, killing and destroying all around her. Just so she can sit on the throne that she sees as her birthright.

She feels entitled to the throne, even though she knows her father (and brother and many other Targaeryans) was mad and completely unfit for rule. She also knows that she sucks at ruling. She's done a terrible job of it in Mereen.

If Dany gets her way, she'll completely destroy the Seven Kingdoms so she can become queen of the ashes. She'll run what's left of the society into the ground through inexperience, lack of diplomacy and lack of any kind of skill in politics at all. And then she'll die, leaving no heir to the throne, because she's barren. Which means another war of succession will kick off and plunge the Seven Kingdoms into anarchy again.

So why are we supposed to want her to do this (other than it making her story less boring)? Why would the crazy dragon lady be a better ruler for Westeros than anyone else? The only claim she has to the throne is that she's the daughter of a terrible former king. Which might be enough to convince some people within the show's world that she's a deserving ruler, but it sure as hell doesn't convince me as a viewer.

I don't see any of this as a legitimate critique. Isn't this sort of the point of her story? She'd be a shitty ruler, but since she has power on her side (in the form of three huge fire-breathing dragons) and genetics, she wants to take the throne. If you recall, Robert Baratheon also took the throne by right of conquest (and it was also known that he had a bit of Targ blood in him)

[Hanley!]

My problem is that I don't think that is the point of her story. The way her scenes are presented and the way other characters talk about her, it's pretty clear we're supposed to think of her as the hero. Even though she really doesn't seem heroic. She's basically the John Cena of Game of Thrones.

[Daz]

To be fair to Dany, she did free thousands upon thousands of slaves and at least make some sort of effort to protect them, even if she is a shitty ruler, whereas John Cena is an awful friend.

[UTK]

My problem is that I don't think that is the point of her story. The way her scenes are presented and the way other characters talk about her, it's pretty clear we're supposed to think of her as the hero. Even though she really doesn't seem heroic. She's basically the John Cena of Game of Thrones.

Yeah, I responded thinking of what she's like in the books. The problem is how honest the show's adaptation of Dany has been. She does the same shit in the books, but the reader is aware of her shortcomings and I think she's supposed to be a hormonal teenage girl who absolutely sucks at everything. She's not intended to actually come across as noble or badass, but the show is trying to do that without changing these things about her.