Yo, Where You At?

[The Legend]

@Everlong
@Messiah

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/06/ted-wells-more-probable-than-not-patriots-manipulated-balls/

And every other Patriots dynasty apologist out there, where you at now that the Deflategate report has come out and has shown plenty of evidence that the Patriots systematically have been caught as dirty, rotten cheaters YET AGAIN? I think it's a joke that Ted Wells saved the Patriots the deserved embarrassment of going up the chain to the top to Belichick for getting caught yet again.

The arrogance of thinking they are above the rules yet again caught them and I love every single second of that. Nothing would be more fitting for this disaster of a year for the NFL than to force them to vacate the dirtiest championship in the history of pro sports this side of the Black Sox.

I can't wait to see Roger Goodell suspend Brady this season and this to all the Patriot whiners complain some more.

No doubt this cements Peyton Manning as the greatest quarterback of this generation - since he knows how to actually FOLLOW THE RULES!!!

[Messiah]

Nothing would be more fitting for this disaster of a year for the NFL than to force them to vacate the dirtiest championship in the history of pro sports this side of the Black Sox.

I can't wait to see Roger Goodell suspend Brady this season

That isn't happening. It's not that serious.

Patriots have been good for a decade plus. Deflated balls has nothing to do with it.

[Everlong]

First of all, never read PFT if you want unbiased looks at anything.

where you at now that the Deflategate report has come out and has shown plenty of evidence that the Patriots systematically have been caught as dirty, rotten cheaters YET AGAIN?

Actually, it hasn't. From the actual report:

"We do not believe evidence supports a conclusion that there was any deliberate effort by Patriots to circumvent NFL’s Rules."

There is zero evidence at all that the Patriots systematically did anything. If anything, the report indicates that Brady and two of the team's equipment people were solely responsible. Read the text messages in the report.

Nothing would be more fitting for this disaster of a year for the NFL than to force them to vacate the dirtiest championship in the history of pro sports this side of the Black Sox.

Please tell me you're joking

[The Legend]

Nothing would be more fitting for this disaster of a year for the NFL than to force them to vacate the dirtiest championship in the history of pro sports this side of the Black Sox.

I can't wait to see Roger Goodell suspend Brady this season

That isn't happening. It's not that serious.

Patriots have been good for a decade plus. Deflated balls has nothing to do with it.

Your right, there's also the illegal spying on their opponents and all their other systems of cheating that haven't been discovered yet. If deflating the footballs don't have any impact, why did they do it? Please someone answer me that. Why would the Patriots do anything that is against the rules unless they viewed it as giving themselves and Tom Brady an advantage?

And yes, I would guess that Brady gets a two game suspension to start this season.

[Everlong]

And yes, I would guess that Brady gets a two game suspension to start this season.

I would take that bet a million times out of a million.

[The Legend]

First of all, never read PFT if you want unbiased looks at anything.

where you at now that the Deflategate report has come out and has shown plenty of evidence that the Patriots systematically have been caught as dirty, rotten cheaters YET AGAIN?

Actually, it hasn't. From the actual report:

"We do not believe evidence supports a conclusion that there was any deliberate effort by Patriots to circumvent NFL’s Rules."

There is zero evidence at all that the Patriots systematically did anything. If anything, the report indicates that Brady and two of the team's equipment people were solely responsible. Read the text messages in the report.

Nothing would be more fitting for this disaster of a year for the NFL than to force them to vacate the dirtiest championship in the history of pro sports this side of the Black Sox.

Please tell me you're joking

First of all, I just grabbed the PFT one because the NFL.com hadn't put out a story yet. I was watching on NFL Network.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000491385/article/wells-report-released-on-footballs-used-in-afc-title-game

From the report...

"we have concluded that, in connection with the AFC Championship Game, it is more probable
than not that New England Patriots personnel participated in violations of the Playing Rules and
were involved in a deliberate effort to circumvent the rules..."

When I say systematically, I mean that the Patriots had a well thought out process involving multiple team employees on how to break league rules. Which the report directly shows. You don't have a system like that if you've only done something once. I'm sure they've done it before many times. Probably each and every game.

And no I'm not joking, please show me another example of a team so aggressively breaking a league rule to gain a competitive advantage over their opponents. It's incredibly rare to the point it doesn't happen. Which is why it's easy to make that statement.

[The Legend]

And yes, I would guess that Brady gets a two game suspension to start this season.

I would take that bet a million times out of a million.

Yeah and if you won it, it would only because Goodell always kisses Kraft, Belichick and Brady's asses every chance he gets.

[Everlong]

When I say systematically, I mean that the Patriots had a well thought out process involving multiple team employees on how to break league rules. Which the report directly shows.

Except it doesn't Almost the entire report has phrases like "Brady generally aware" or "more probable than not." It presents a lot of different types of evidence, but no real conclusive proof. It shows in the language used throughout the report.

Granted, it wouldn't be out of the usual for the NFL to punish players/teams without any actual conclusive proof, but come on:

1. This isn't a big deal AT ALL

and 2. even if it is, the report shows that there is still no conclusive proof, ESPECIALLY regarding organizational involvement by the Patriots.

The report makes Brady look bad, but it doesn't completely damn him or the team. Let's be real here.

[War Daddy]

In conclusion:"We can't say anything because we don't know and everything is just a guess. Go Goats."

[Everlong]

In conclusion:"We can't say anything because we don't know and everything is just a guess. Go Goats."

That's pretty much what it is though. The language used throughout the entirety of the report basically admits that nothing is known for sure.

[The Legend]

Man, apologists still gonna apologize. The report is pretty clear in this respect. There is no scientific way for those balls to have been deflated that much naturally. Therefore, if you remove all things impossible, you are left with what's possible. The only thing left is that people with the New England Patriots organization intentionally deflated the balls. They cheated. Why can't some people understand that?

[The Legend]

Man, apologists still gonna apologize. The report is pretty clear in this respect. There is no scientific way for those balls to have been deflated that much naturally. Therefore, if you remove all things impossible, you are left with what's possible. The only thing left is that people with the New England Patriots organization intentionally deflated the balls. They cheated. Why can't some people understand that?

[Everlong]

There is no scientific way for those balls to have been deflated that much naturally. Therefore, if you remove all things impossible, you are left with what's possible.

Dude, nobody's denying the balls were deflated. I'm saying that

a) There's STILL no conclusive evidence to put the Patriots organization at all behind this and

b) Even if there was, it's not a big deal in the least. Like there aren't enough words for me to emphasize how not big of a deal this is.

[The Legend]

There is no scientific way for those balls to have been deflated that much naturally. Therefore, if you remove all things impossible, you are left with what's possible.

Dude, nobody's denying the balls were deflated. I'm saying that

a) There's STILL no conclusive evidence to put the Patriots organization at all behind this and

b) Even if there was, it's not a big deal in the least. Like there aren't enough words for me to emphasize how not big of a deal this is.

a) There's no scientific way for the footballs to deflate that much in the time talked about. If it can't happen naturally, it has to happen unnaturally. Therefore the team was behind the balls being deflated.

b) If it makes no difference, why did that Patriots do it? If it's no big deal and doesn't offer the team any advantage on the field why break the rule and risk this situation? It obviously makes a difference at some point.

Now did it cause them to win the AFC Championship game? No, probably not. Was this the only game this season or any other season that they deflated balls? Probably not. you wouldn't just decide to do something like this and change the balls in a way for such an important game if you didn't know it provided you an advantage.

The Patriots wound up with home field advantage over the Broncos due to tiebreakers as both teams finished at 12-4. The Patriots won three regular season games by one touchdown or less. The Wells Report indicates on multiple occasions that these employees and Brady were in communication about doing similar things throughout the regular season. Now in those games, I don't think you can totally say that the illegal balls wouldn't help them enough to win those games where they might not have won with regulation balls. Maybe a Brady pass goes off target. Maybe it get's tipped. Maybe a heavier ball does fly as far on a deep pass causing it to be picked off. Maybe a receiver doesn't catch a key pass because a firmer ball is harder to catch. Maybe a running back fumbles because a firmer ball is harder to hold onto. Maybe Brady loses grip on a firmer ball.

We'll never know because the Patriots cheated. But what if they didn't cheat and one of those games goes the other way. That would have totally changed the AFC playoff picture. Now instead of being a 12-4 team that holds the #1 seed the Patriots are an 11-5 team that's tied for the second through fourth seed in the AFC with the Steelers and Colts. Due to the AFC conference record the Patriots would have actually slipped all the way to the fourth seed with a conference record of 8-4.

Now instead of a first round bye the Patriots play the Bengals in the first round. The Pats likely win that game, but it's another game against a physical football team that increases the chances of injury and other things. But for the sake of argument let's say the Pats advance unscathed from the game and advance. In the Divisional Round, instead of getting to play the Ravens at home, New England has to travel to either Denver or Pittsburgh (the new top two seeds) depending on what happens in the Ravens @ Colts new Wild Card Weekend match up created by the team re-shuffling thanks to the Patriots new record. I don't think it's automatic that you can say they survive either of those opponents. And even if they do they would have needed to survive the next one the week following.

Can you honestly say that the Patriots under inflating footballs couldn't have possibly had some bearing somewhere throughout the season on how the AFC playoffs were shaped and how they turned out? I really, seriously doubt you could possibly say that without a doubt breaking those rules had no impact on the Patriots being the representative in the Super Bowl and thereby winning the Super Bowl.

Now, I certainly feel bad for the two poor scapegoats that Belichick, Brady and Kraft have shoved in front of the Patriots team bus to get run over, backed over and run over again.

[Locke]

God, I can't believe people are still debating this.

Anyway, the Patriots fuckin' did it and nobody cares.

[DBSoT]

Gronk being Gronk.