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Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

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Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Oct 22, '13, 5:36 pm

What a bank heist they committed when they stole a first round pick from Indianapolis for Trent Richardson.

I never exactly understood why people thought Richardson was any kind of good in the first place. He had piss poor vision and atrocious acceleration for Cleveland and none of that appeared to be changing. Richardson is just a bad back. But more than that, I can't believe they got a first round pick for him. What film was Indianapolis watching?

Aside from the Herschel Walker and Ricky Williams trades, I truly cannot think of a single worse trade, especially since the beginning of the 00s. Richardson wouldn't even be good enough for me to take in the 2nd or 3rd round when considering the other backs who have been picked up that late.

Shame because Indianapolis looks like a team on the rise. But they just threw away a first round pick for no reason and now won't be able to add to their team in what will be a loaded 2014 NFL Draft Class.

Moved to Classics on Feb. 11th, 2014.

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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Everlong » Oct 22, '13, 5:38 pm

I will be the first person to admit that I was completely wrong about my assessment of that trade. Maybe I was just blinded by the fact that Richardson was a former #3 overall pick, but my god... I can't believe they actually managed to get a first round pick out of the Colts. In hindsight it was a genius move by the Browns organization. They took a ton of shit for it, but it proves why people like that are running football organizations and why people like me are sitting on the couch :lol
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Kyle » Oct 22, '13, 5:57 pm

He's definitely been a bust so far, to the point where if he gains three yards you'd be happy. Maybe he will be better next year after a full camp but he is definitely going to need to improve.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Oct 22, '13, 6:05 pm

It's not that bad at all. Sure Richardson is pretty mediocre but he is pretty good in short yardage situations. The Colts are still 5-2 and the 1st round pick most likely would be a very late pick in the draft.

The Colts will have well over 20 million dollars in cap room for free agency so I don't see who we could possibly be missing out in the draft with a 22-26 pick. It was a fair trade on both sides.

Comparing this a Herschel Walker and Ricky Williams trade is an overraction to the max lol. There's no way this trade is even remotely close to the Ricky Williams or Herschel Walker trade that literally gave up all their draft picks for one player.

It's just ONE PICK and the Colts had one of the toughest schedules in the NFL season. Literally this is the most premature assesment I've read. The main blame should be against Pep Hamilton because he is forcing a lot of predictable runs that defenses read very easily. Pep Hamilton's predictable scheme is hurting the progression of Andrew Luck and Trent Richardson. He wants a power run scheme when we simply don't have the offensive line for it.

The fact that you compare this to the Herschel Walker and Ricky Williams trade is borderline moronic. Way to be a Titans homer.

I seem to remember you called us idiots for trading for Vontae Davis yet PFF gave Vonate Davis a +7.9 grade (+7.5 coverage) for his play against DEN. That's the highest single-game grade they've ever given a CB.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Oct 22, '13, 7:19 pm

I didn't compare it to the Hershel Walker and Ricky Williams trade. I said excluding (well actually I said aside but same thing) them because they are clearly the 2 worst trades of all-time.

But continue to throw out baseless comments directed at me. They ignite my fire. :D
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Oct 22, '13, 9:03 pm

Messiah wrote:I didn't compare it to the Hershel Walker and Ricky Williams trade. I said excluding (well actually I said aside but same thing) them because they are clearly the 2 worst trades of all-time.

But continue to throw out baseless comments directed at me. They ignite my fire. :D


When Trent Richardson was drafted third overall by the Cleveland Browns in the 2012 NFL Draft, many expected instant success due to his collegiate performance and impressive physical abilities, if not draft status alone. At first glance, his base statistics (3.5 career yard per carry average) and rare in-season trade last month to the Colts seem to indicate that he has been unsuccessful professionally thus far. But, as our own Ben Stockwell indicated in his review of the Week 6 Colts at Chargers game, Richardson deserves some credit for the effort he puts in to gaining those minimal yards. A closer look at one of our signature stats, Elusive Rating, shows that Richardson
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Everlong » Oct 22, '13, 10:17 pm

Well yeah, you trade because you want to upgrade. But is Richardson enough of an upgrade over the existing players that he was worth a first round pick?

So far the answer is a resounding "no." Of course, there's still plenty of time for him to turn it around, but as of right now it looks like the Browns easily got the better deal.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Oct 22, '13, 10:50 pm

Rushing touchdowns are a very misleading statistic. Tolbert in 2010 had 735 yards (4.0 YPC) and 11 touchdowns. Would you consider him to have had an impressive season? They are entirely dependent on if that team is willing to give you a bunch of opportunities in the redzone. Scoring from 5 yards or so out truly shouldn't be that difficult so to me, Richardson scoring 11 touchdowns doesn't mean much of all to me. It is only 1 less than Peterson's amount last year yet I have my doubts that you would consider Richardson as good as getting the ball into the endzone as Peterson is. It is entirely dependent on opportunity. Richardson was afforded that and he is solid in short yardage, sure. But it isn't that impressive to me.

We can ignore or not ignore stats. If we don't ignore it, it doesn't matter because his numbers are still quite poor. If we do ignore it, we have a running back with horrendous burst and vision. The reason Richardson doesn't get to the second level is because he lacks the change of direction or vision to do so, at least not consistently. No different than Mark Ingram, two products of the Alabama offensive line.

It most certainly is robbery. Indianapolis could be getting equal production from a third round running back. Just from this draft, we have Eddie Lacy and Giovani Bernard from the second round outproducing Richardson. Backs aren't that difficult to find. I said it on the other forum. And these days, you do not spend or trade a first round pick for a mediocre back like Richardson who is as dependent on his offensive line as you are making it out to be. Cleveland basically traded away a below average running back for a first round pick. That is robbery no matter how you slice it.

So the fault really is on Pep Hamilton and the offensive line but of course blaming Trent Richardson is the popular thing to do when you don't analyze the game and just pay attention to yellow journalism.


Then why does Donald Brown routinely look better than Richardson whenever he runs the ball when they are running behind the same offensive line with the same offensive coordinator?

I am watching the games. And I have watched Richardson. I said the same thing about Richardson even before he put on an Indianapolis uniform and even before a trade to them was announced. Richardson last year was a below average running back. It isn't the OC or the blocking. Are they good? No. But neither is Richardson.

And if Richardson is this dependent on everyone around him, is he truly worth a first round pick?
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Oct 22, '13, 10:56 pm

I think I will end it there, actually. I think you and I could debate for days on whether Richardson is any good or not.

However, this is the deal breaker for me. I don't believe running backs nowadays who aren't elite or game changers such as Peterson, McCoy, or Charles to be worth a first round pick in the first place. If Richardson is dependent on everyone else as much as you make it sound like, is he in your opinion truly worth a first round pick? Don't get me wrong, I am not saying he doesn't deserve excuses. I don't expect him to go gangbusters on the NFL. But if your running game is still among the worst in the NFL, then maybe your first round pick could have been better served elsewhere if it hasn't improved your squad at all. Indianapolis with or without Richardson is the same.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Everlong » Oct 22, '13, 10:59 pm

The 49ers picked up Anquan Boldin, a player with a history of success (and recent success, dat beastly postseason) for a 6th round pick and he's contributed far and away more than Richardson has. NOBODY trades first round picks any more unless it's part of a blockbuster deal (think Bears trading for Cutler, or Redskins trading up for RGIII). This is what makes it such a bad deal (as of right now) for the Colts. All draft picks are valuable, first round picks especially so.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby motionmann » Oct 22, '13, 11:37 pm

"Marshawn Lynch through 5 games w/Seahawks following trade with Bills: 217 yds, 2 TDs, 2.9 ypc. Let's not bury Trent Richardson yet, folks."

Saw this on twitter.

Obviously, there's a slight difference seeing as Marshawn was a proven RB in the NFL before the trade. But he wasn't having his best years after his rookie year either. So, take it for what it's worth.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Oct 22, '13, 11:52 pm

As of right now, pretty much everything is subjective. The only thing I'd disagree with you Messiah is Donald Brown's numbers are very misleading. For the past couple of weeks his had about the same number of snaps as Trent and his best game as a running back this year was 37 yards against the Seattle Seahawks. Most of his runs have been coming from delayed handoffs in a four wideout set. I think he has yet to see a snap in the power run I-formation this year.


reyflyinfury619 wrote:The 49ers picked up Anquan Boldin, a player with a history of success (and recent success, dat beastly postseason) for a 6th round pick and he's contributed far and away more than Richardson has. NOBODY trades first round picks any more unless it's part of a blockbuster deal (think Bears trading for Cutler, or Redskins trading up for RGIII). This is what makes it such a bad deal (as of right now) for the Colts. All draft picks are valuable, first round picks especially so.


I agree with what you've said. I would've loved to see that first round pick go for someone like Joe Thomas or Joe Haden on the Browns. The reason why I can understand the move is because we lost Vick Ballard for the season, we ended up losing Ahmad Bradshaw as well. If we didn't get Trent Richardson, we'd be left with Donald Brown and Dan Herron.

As for Anquan Boldin he pretty much said he would retire if he wasn't a Baltimore Raven next year. I guess the Ravens shipped him off for whatever they could get but he oddly never ended up retiring.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby The Legend » Oct 23, '13, 5:40 am

This trade isn't over yet, so you can't say what the true results are. The bottom line is we won't know whether Cleveland robbed Indy until the draft is over next year. It wasn't worth a thing if they don't get a great player with that first round pick and a running back that's at least as good as Richardson later in the draft. Right now it's a push because Cleveland doesn't have anything to show for it and Richardson hasn't given Indy a huge boost.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Nov 03, '13, 10:41 pm

Indianapolis tried to close the game out right now with Richardson.

He ran for -2 yards. Once again out-yarded by Donald Brown and ran the ball 6 times before that drive.

Cleveland stay trollin'.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby DanielsonTHAGOAT » Nov 03, '13, 10:53 pm

Messiah wrote:Indianapolis tried to close the game out right now with Richardson.

He ran for -2 yards. Once again out-yarded by Donald Brown and ran the ball 6 times before that drive.

Cleveland stay trollin'.

And he had a huge screen play that led to the comeback by the Colts so they could get a huge score. No running back EVER runs for 10 yards to close out the game against the Texans. LMAO. We wanted to waste clock and that's exactly what we did.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Chewy » Nov 05, '13, 10:17 am

Cleveland teams always seem to get the rub of the green. They've had like the last fifteen number one picks in every sport and still think they're being hard done by.

Makes it easier to laugh at them as they fail.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby The Legend » Nov 05, '13, 10:50 am

Chewy wrote:Cleveland teams always seem to get the rub of the green. They've had like the last fifteen number one picks in every sport and still think they're being hard done by.

Makes it easier to laugh at them as they fail.


As if, the Browns haven't had the #1 pick since 2000. And well the baseball draft doesn't matter.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Messiah » Nov 10, '13, 2:12 pm

DanielsonTHAGOAT wrote:
Messiah wrote:Indianapolis tried to close the game out right now with Richardson.

He ran for -2 yards. Once again out-yarded by Donald Brown and ran the ball 6 times before that drive.

Cleveland stay trollin'.

And he had a huge screen play that led to the comeback by the Colts so they could get a huge score. No running back EVER runs for 10 yards to close out the game against the Texans. LMAO. We wanted to waste clock and that's exactly what we did.


I guess no running back ever runs for 10 yards in an ENTIRE GAME against the Rams, either. :lol

5 attempts, 2 yards, 5 yards coming on 1 run.
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby Everlong » Nov 10, '13, 3:23 pm

I love that this thread keeps getting brought back every week :lol
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Re: Cleveland should be under arrest for robbery

Postby xgamr » Nov 12, '13, 8:47 pm

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