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Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Everlong » Apr 09, '18, 12:40 pm

PorkChop wrote:On a side note, does anyone remember @Everlong's "Triple H has turned his back on the fans" thread?

Contender for the best thread of all time tbh.


Oh god, worked a whole bunch of marks into a shoot in that thread, brother :tim :tim :tim
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Hanley! » Apr 09, '18, 12:45 pm

Str8Shooter wrote:I'll put it this way, I think he's a net positive for WWE.


Well, yeah.

I don't think anyone disagrees with that. Triple H is responsible for NXT, which is really the only WWE programming that I enjoy. And I don't just enjoy it, I love most Takeover shows. He's doing a great job.

But that's not the point. I'm not weighing the pros and cons of Triple H's existence or his merits as a WWE employee. I'm just saying that he is over-represented at Wrestlemania. He consistently pushes himself at a higher level than his talent and the landscape of the company warrants. It makes shows worse and it stifles the growth of other performers. I don't think we need to balance that against the good stuff he does with the company. We can just accept that it's true and hope for change.

To clarify, it's not like I think he does this because he's evil. He's not trying to keep people down. He does try to nurture a lot of upcoming talent, and I think he wants to help people get over. But he's also selfish. He still wants to be a star himself. It's human nature. He wants the longest matches and the most important matches, and because of who he is, he gets them whether he deserves them or not. I don't even really blame him as much as I blame Vince for not keeping him in check.

I don't even automatically hate everything he's involved in. Over the last decade, he's probably had about the same amount of good matches and bad matches at Wrestlemania. The bigger problem is I just don't care.

I don't care about Triple H the on screen character anymore. I don't know why anyone does. To me, it doesn't matter how good his match was last night, because I didn't watch it. And I didn't watch it because I don't care. To really enjoy a Wrestlemania, I need to invest in the characters involved and I can't do that with him anymore.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby DBSoT » Apr 09, '18, 1:13 pm

Rousey was great in that match. The rest of it annoyed the crap out of me. Stephanie being able to fight off the arm bar was ridiculous. It is a move that has beaten tons of women in a UFC ring, but somehow Steph figured it out. :facepalm HHH was basically there so the match had a reason to be on for 20+ minutes. Angle was fine, but he moves terribly now a days. The match was 10 minutes longer then it needed to be and at points felt a bit like oddly paced.

With that said, I thought Rousey looked great. She looked comfortable in most of her moves and was able to find her character. Her death stare and trash talking before hitting moves was well done. She is still going to need time before she can have a lengthy 1 on 1 match, but you actually saw signs of real potential talent.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Str8Shooter » Apr 09, '18, 1:26 pm

DBSoT wrote:Rousey was great in that match. The rest of it annoyed the crap out of me. Stephanie being able to fight off the arm bar was ridiculous. It is a move that has beaten tons of women in a UFC ring, but somehow Steph figured it out. :facepalm


I think people really have to stop thinking like this. This is not MMA, she's not an MMA fighter anymore. There are copious amounts of pro wrestling moves that should kill or severely injure people for real but because we're conditioned to not believe they hurt people that badly in wrestling, it's fine. Wrestling is about drama, there rarely been any submission in wrestling history that has tapped people out instantly or quickly all the time.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Hanley! » Apr 09, '18, 1:39 pm

Str8Shooter wrote:I think people really have to stop thinking like this. This is not MMA, she's not an MMA fighter anymore. There are copious amounts of pro wrestling moves that should kill or severely injure people for real but because we're conditioned to not believe they hurt people that badly in wrestling, it's fine. Wrestling is about drama, there rarely been any submission in wrestling history that has tapped people out instantly or quickly all the time.


It's not even the MMA connection though. Stephanie isn't a wrestler, she's the spoiled daughter of the CEO. If she was in there with Charlotte or Asuka or even Bayley, I'd find it equally ridiculous. I'm equally annoyed when Shane is competitive against main event level guys. It's not realistic and it's not good storytelling. Nobody buys the McMahons as tough guys.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby The Legend » Apr 09, '18, 1:59 pm

Hanley! wrote:
Str8Shooter wrote:I think people really have to stop thinking like this. This is not MMA, she's not an MMA fighter anymore. There are copious amounts of pro wrestling moves that should kill or severely injure people for real but because we're conditioned to not believe they hurt people that badly in wrestling, it's fine. Wrestling is about drama, there rarely been any submission in wrestling history that has tapped people out instantly or quickly all the time.


It's not even the MMA connection though. Stephanie isn't a wrestler, she's the spoiled daughter of the CEO. If she was in there with Charlotte or Asuka or even Bayley, I'd find it equally ridiculous. I'm equally annoyed when Shane is competitive against main event level guys. It's not realistic and it's not good storytelling. Nobody buys the McMahons as tough guys.


I endorse this statement.

On a side note about this match. They need to find Ronda some better fitting clothes to wear before her next match, after every move she did or was done to her she was re-adjusting this or that instead of selling what was going on, I found it really distracting after a while.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby DBSoT » Apr 09, '18, 2:53 pm

Str8Shooter wrote:
DBSoT wrote:Rousey was great in that match. The rest of it annoyed the crap out of me. Stephanie being able to fight off the arm bar was ridiculous. It is a move that has beaten tons of women in a UFC ring, but somehow Steph figured it out. :facepalm


I think people really have to stop thinking like this. This is not MMA, she's not an MMA fighter anymore. There are copious amounts of pro wrestling moves that should kill or severely injure people for real but because we're conditioned to not believe they hurt people that badly in wrestling, it's fine. Wrestling is about drama, there rarely been any submission in wrestling history that has tapped people out instantly or quickly all the time.


@Hanley! is correct. Stephanie has always been presented as a weak wrestler. I am not going to suddenly start believing that she is physically strong enough to counter Ronda Rousey's armbar.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby The Legend » Apr 09, '18, 4:07 pm

DBSoT wrote:
Str8Shooter wrote:
DBSoT wrote:Rousey was great in that match. The rest of it annoyed the crap out of me. Stephanie being able to fight off the arm bar was ridiculous. It is a move that has beaten tons of women in a UFC ring, but somehow Steph figured it out. :facepalm


I think people really have to stop thinking like this. This is not MMA, she's not an MMA fighter anymore. There are copious amounts of pro wrestling moves that should kill or severely injure people for real but because we're conditioned to not believe they hurt people that badly in wrestling, it's fine. Wrestling is about drama, there rarely been any submission in wrestling history that has tapped people out instantly or quickly all the time.


@Hanley! is correct. Stephanie has always been presented as a weak wrestler. I am not going to suddenly start believing that she is physically strong enough to counter Ronda Rousey's armbar.


And if she is strong enough, that also hurts Ronda's credability that she's not as strong as I thought she was, which hurts future matches against real competitors.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby KaiserGlider » Apr 09, '18, 9:14 pm

Haitch just can't catch a break. He carries three people to the match of the night at Wrestlemania, and yet the biggest takeaway for some of you is that it's just another ego trip for Triple H.

The match last night was clearly not about Triple H, it was about Ronda Rousey. And to that end, Triple H has done a fantastic job introducing her to the WWE. He has sold all of her moves like a million bucks and made her look like a badass. Don't make it seem like there was a much better match for Ronda at this Wrestlemania and Triple H stuck his nose in just to get himself over, because this was the best match and the best story Ronda could have had right now. So I don't get what the problem is.

If we look at Triple H's Wrestlemania matches over the last couple years, none of them have been about him.

Rollins' career was not "stagnated" by feuding with Triple H, that seems like revisionist history when in fact it was the exact opposite. Rollins had his best run as a babyface in the buildup to Wrestlemania 33 and had arguably his best singles match and babyface moment when he beat Triple H at Wrestlemania. Rollin's career since then has been unremarkable, but I don't see how that can't be attributed more to the whole company's shitting booking than Triple H. It's like if Rollins isn't main eventing Wrestlemania then Triple H putting him over doesn't count. You can look at it as Rollins jerking the curtain a year later while Triple H is in a big match. Or you can look at it as Rollins winning a championship in a great match while Triple H got his ass handed to him all over the place.

Against Reigns the year before, yeah, nobody was asking for this match. But it was still clearly all about Roman and not Triple H. At that point, Roman's best moment was brutalizing Triple H at the TLC PPV.

The year before that against Sting - despite the fact that Triple H should not have won, he was not the attraction, Sting was. Like with Ronda, this was about introducing Sting to WWE. Having Sting debut at Survivor Series by challenging the company's biggest heel was a smart way to bring him in. Pretty sure at least a few people were looking forward to Sting/HHH after that. And to be fair, seeing as how Triple H has lost every match since then, the win here doesn't seem that heinous in hindsight.

Wrestlemania 30 against Bryan: Ask yourself if this storyline would have been anywhere near as good without Triple H being the smug corporate antagonist. HELL no. When it came down to it, he put Bryan over like a million bucks. And once again, the fact that Bryan got shafted the following year - was that Triple H's fault, or Vince McMahon/WWE's fault?

Over the past few years, Triple H has not been afraid to embarrass himself, get his ass kicked, and sell like a motherfucker to get somebody over. You can say it's wrong for him to always be in a prominent spot at Wrestlemania and that better people could fill that spot. And you could be right. But not necessarily.

I look at Triple H as one of the best in the business when it comes to making others look good, and a large part of that is because he's Triple H and seeing him get whooped still means something. If it didn't, the Ronda/HHH moment last night wouldn't have gone over as well as it did. He can obviously still get a big reaction from the crowd and is capable of putting together a long match, which is more than I can say for Brock or Taker. I wouldn't mind if he continues to have spots at Wrestlemania if they are like his last two against Ronda and Rollins.

-----------

I didn't have a problem with Stephanie avoiding the armbar for a while there. They kept talking about how Steph is constantly working out and staying in shape all year long. It makes sense that she trained like hell to avoid that one submission move of Ronda's at all costs.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Messiah » Apr 09, '18, 9:19 pm

I’ll respond to the rest of that later, but how in the hell did he carry that tag match? You can’t belueve that. I’m not denying he did a good job, but carried? Come on now. Rousey was great.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby KaiserGlider » Apr 09, '18, 9:31 pm

Messiah wrote:I’ll respond to the rest of that later, but how in the hell did he carry that tag match? You can’t belueve that. I’m not denying he did a good job, but carried? Come on now. Rousey was great.


Okay, maybe carry wasn't the right word. But it's very likely that Triple H put the match together and told Ronda what to do. Considering that there are reports of him doing this in the past, Steph lacks experience and Angle is a shell of himself, I can believe that.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Messiah » Apr 09, '18, 9:53 pm

I could possibly concede to some of the stuff you are saying, but this idea that a lot of Triple H fans use that he's somehow made so many people look good is something I'll never understand. Look, if you like Triple H and what he brings to the table, that is fine. But saying Triple H is one of the best at making other people look good is akin to saying Steve Austin put over a lot of talent. It isn't true. It doesn't make Austin some terrible wrestler, obviously, just like the fact Triple H has harmed more wrestlers than helped him doesn't make him the worst in the world. I'm not seeing the countless examples of Triple H making others look good though. I'd argue, for example, John Cena has done a much better job at that the last couple of years.

One of the arguments you make is that the matches haven't been about him. I don't get the logic behind that? Sure, they haven't been about him in the sense that he isn't who the fans are most looking forward to... but how is that supposed to be a good thing? Storyline wise, they always revolve around something Triple H has done because he finds a way to get involved in what is hot. Nevermind the fact that he won the match; it isn't so much that he beat Sting so much as the fact he was in the match with him to begin with. Nobody wanted to see Triple H vs Sting. Nobody at all. But it had to be Triple H because it is always Triple H.

Wrestlemania 30 against Bryan: Ask yourself if this storyline would have been anywhere near as good without Triple H being the smug corporate antagonist. HELL no. When it came down to it, he put Bryan over like a million bucks.


What? Daniel Bryan was ridiculously over long before Triple H's involvement, which is why Triple H got involved (the theme here is that the acts are hot, which leads to Triple H sticking his hand in it). You do realize that, right? Just about any evil authority figure could have filled his role and the results would have been the same. There is a reason Bryan was facing Cena at SummerSlam in the first place.

Regardless, you are missing the bigger picture of my post anyway. This isn't about nit-picking every match Triple H has had at WrestleMania. Nowhere in my post did I criticize the Bryan/HHH story-line. I didn't criticize the Rollins/HHH story-line. Etc. My overall point is that every year, Triple H finds his way to get involved with whomever the hottest act in the company is to no fail. And who has it ever benefited? Even if I were to give you Rollins and Bryan, we're talking about 2 guys in the last 10 years. Who benefited from Triple H vs Sting? Or Triple H vs Brock Lesnar? Or Triple H vs The Undertaker? Or Triple H vs Roman Reigns? And all of those matches sans HHH/Undertaker at WrestleMania 28, so lets stop pretending like I'm unfairly bashing some work-rate magician here. Triple H has had as many duds as successes. Rousey certainly didn't benefit; she was a made-woman. Triple H didn't need to get involved, but he did anyway. Is it bad if you look at it in a microscope as you are doing? Of course not. But when you follow the patters and realize this has been a problem with Triple H for more than a decade, then I don't know how you don't get tired of it.

If you are that much of a fan of Triple H, and I say that with no sarcasm or a condescending tone, then that is okay. Fair enough. I can see why you would be entertained. But I'm not sure how you don't see the merit of my argument. Triple H isn't the best wrestler in the WWE, but at the biggest show of the year, he's often in the longest match. He isn't the most over wrestler in the WWE, but at the biggest show of the year, he's guaranteed to be in one of the 2 biggest matches. It is tiresome. It is stale. Triple H is stale. Honestly, I don't get why anyone would be interested in him anymore. And it is a problem.

But lets go back to Triple H being one of the best at making other people look good because I'm not seeing it. Who has Triple H helped make look better? If you want to say Daniel Bryan, I'd love an explanation. Bryan was bonkers over to begin with. I'll reluctantly give you Rollins for the sake of discussion. Who else though? Because it seems like you are nit-picking those two without discussing the others. He definitely didn't make Reigns look better - if anything, Reigns' feud with Triple H only led to him getting booed even more. You can blame that on booking or whatever, but it doesn't change the fact that it was a position nobody wanted to see Triple H in hence the reactions to the match. Nobody was interested.

So who else? Who are all these guys Triple H has been impressive in making look better? It comes across as a baseless statement to me because quite frankly, I'm not seeing it.

All I know is Triple H has controlled the spotlight of the biggest show of the year for almost 20 years now. Why people can't see the problem with it, I'm not sure. This isn't me saying Triple H is a terrible wrestler or that I hate him, which seems to be the only thing a couple of you are taking away from everything. What I'm saying is for a guy who isn't the caliber of a lot of other guys in the ring on the roster or as over as some guys from present and past, he's somehow managed to make it seem like he's the best at both every WrestleMania. If you are cool with that, it's okay. I'm not trying to convince you or Shooter or anyone else not to be a Triple H fan, and I've long accepted the WWE isn't for me hence why I don't watch Raw or Smackdown or 90% of the PPVs. At the same time though, how can you not at least understand why someone like me would have a problem with someone I view as uninteresting and stale as Triple H (and I would think, even if you like Triple H, surely you agree he's stale?) managing to get involved in every big thing in the company (Rousey in 2018, Lesnar in 2013, Punk in 2011, Sting in 2015, Reigns in 2016, the Streak, etc) every year? It would be akin to me acting oblivious as to why people might not like Aleister Black, or me pretending to not understand why people boo Reigns or booed Cena. Even if you like Reigns or Cena, you understand, you get it. And that is all I'm saying. Do you not, at the very least, get why I, and probably more people than just me (because based off crowd reactions, it isn't like Triple H is blowing the roof off any arena), are tired of him being so heavily involved every year?
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Messiah » Apr 09, '18, 10:02 pm

And I don't feel any sympathy towards Triple H or that I'm giving him too hard of a time. John Cena and The Undertaker have taken a back-seat multiple times in their career. Cena hasn't had an overly-hyped match in a long time and guess what? It's made him far more interesting and beloved by the fans. He isn't constantly in matches he doesn't belong in (Rousey vs Steph would have been just fine if we were going that route; the inclusion of Angle was literally just to get Triple H involved) or where the match-up doesn't make sense (HHH/Sting, HHH/Lesnar, HHH/Reigns). It has been different with Undertaker in his later years, but even he only faced Bray Wyatt at WM 31 and he had some not-so-noteworthy WrestleMania matches with Henry and Show.

All I'm asking is for Triple H to take a backseat. Some of you make it seem like I'm asking for him to retire (although I wouldn't mind it). How can you guys not see why that is something someone like me would want? You would have to be purposely blinding yourself to not see that Triple H, ON A WHOLE, has been put on a pedestal that has gone too far. I'm rightfully tired of it.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby AkydefGoldberg » Apr 10, '18, 6:54 am

Only interesting aspect for me in regards to HHH's involvement in recent Mania's that I've been watching (admittedly, not all of them) is him potentially using his real-life competitive battles with say, The Rock, in the booking of some of his high-profile matches. WM27, HHH out of the blue ends up feuding with Taker, the year later it's a rematch with a HIAC taking up the longest match of the night as the previous posts suggest. And as much as publicly, him and Rock get on fine, I'd find it hard to believe some of that inner tension and ego has just dissipated with age
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby PorkChop » Apr 10, '18, 8:08 am

Did Triple H and The Rock genuinely have issues with one another? If so, when/why?
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby Str8Shooter » Apr 10, '18, 8:24 am

PorkChop wrote:Did Triple H and The Rock genuinely have issues with one another? If so, when/why?


The extent I don't think has ever really been known. I believe it goes back to when Triple H was with HBK during the original DX days in 97 and they didn't particularly like young Rocky Maivia or think he was any good and told management so. I think Bret talked about it a bit in his book.

Then again Rock and HHH worked extensively with each other throughout 2000 and it might've been their best work so who knows.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby AkydefGoldberg » Apr 10, '18, 8:46 am

PorkChop wrote:Did Triple H and The Rock genuinely have issues with one another? If so, when/why?


Like @Str8Shooter said, it developed into a competitive personal rivalry that brought out the best in each other when they worked but working on seperate programs, both wanted to out-do each other which is fine but not to the detriment of others and the company. Bret Hart liked The Rock when he broke through and was incredibly helpful to Rock, whilst HHH was with HBK (to the point when HHH won the WM main event in which Rock was supposed to win having won the Rumble - a fatal four way if I recollect) and the battle lines were drawn.

They seem to get on very well publicly and talk good of each other, but Trips seems like a guy who'd keep a feud going unnecessarily whilst I imagine it's the last thing on Rock's mind given his career trajectory.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby KaiserGlider » Apr 10, '18, 10:29 pm

@Messiah

You keep saying that you don't understand how people aren't seeing your point. I think I see it. What I can't see is why you're choosing to make that argument right now. If this discussion had taken place two years ago, right after Reigns/HHH, then I probably would have been inclined to agree with most of your points. If the mixed tag match with Ronda had sucked, I probably wouldn't be on the opposite side of this discussion. But it was the match of the night at Wrestlemania. It surpassed all expectations and almost everyone seemed to love it. Yet the only takeaway you seem to get from it is that Triple H was in the longest match at Wrestlemania, that it was just another attempt for HHH to hog the spotlight, HHH this, HHH that. I don't get it. Is he the one shoving himself into things too much, or are you shoving him in needlessly?

Like you, I don't want to get too bogged down with every Triple H match at Wrestlemania. But Ronda/Angle vs HHH/Steph is really at the heart of my main point, as well as being the topic of this thread anyway, so I'll start with it. You say it's a match Triple H didn't need to get involved in, yet the supposedly better alternative you provide is... Ronda vs Steph in a singles match? That would have been terrible. Everyone would have been saying how unbelievable it is for Steph to be booked as any sort of threat to Ronda. The mixed tag played to everyone's strengths and hid their weaknesses; it let Steph get a ton of cheapshots in and still get clobbered by Ronda when it was one-on-one, and it let Ronda look good against a 14-time world champion. You claim that Ronda was "already made" and didn't gain anything from HHH's involvement. Compare the crowd reactions she got after the match and the next night on Raw to her first couple of segments. Then watch the match again and see that the two biggest pops Ronda got was when she was punching Triple H and lifting him up in the fireman's carry. I know you were marking out for that shit in the shoutbox.

I would also argue that Triple H was the least important person in the buildup to that match. Ronda was the star whom it was built around, Steph was the one confronting her the most, and Angle was the one who added fuel to the fire when he revealed that Steph thought Ronda was washed up, plus it was his first Wrestlemania in 12 years. Besides, the entire program was designed to introduce Ronda to WWE fans and put her over. This was achieved, and Haitch/Speth deserve credit for their part in making it happen. How is that "looking at it in a microscope". If anything it's looking at the big picture. What you're doing is ignoring these facts and focusing on irrelevant information.

It was probably the least offensive use of Triple H in Wrestlemania in a long time. He was in a tag match, which he lost, to put over a new superstar. Which again is why I think it's a weird time to be having this debate.

Yes, Triple H has been putting himself in a big match at almost every Wrestlemania for the past 20 years even when he shouldn't have. Yes, in the past he has often been shit at putting wrestlers over. I agree with all of this, and at times it has pissed me off like everyone else here. But I'm not seeing this negative trend in regards to his Wrestlemanias that that has FINALLY GONE TOO FAR and we should all be so concerned about it. Maybe I would if all of Triple H's Wrestlemania matches sucked, or if he shouldn't have been in any of them, or if they were always the biggest selling point of Wrestlemania, or if he hasn't put anybody over. But I don't think any of that is true.

So I don't see the point of dredging up his entire career history and comparing where he was 10 years ago, or even 5 years ago to where he is now. Cena 5 years ago was different. Haitch 5 years ago was different. It's why I only highlighted his most recent Wrestlemania matches before, because the only one of those that I feel shouldn't have happened and/or didn't deliver was HHH/Reigns (and even then I didn't think it was a bad match) and to a lesser extent HHH/Brock. I can say positive things about the rest of them. I think he's had far more good matches than bad ones.

Over the last few years I would definitely say that HHH has gotten much better at putting people over than he used to be. He is one of the best sellers in the company (think Sunday vs Ronda, Survivor Series against Braun). You seem to agree with me when it comes to Seth Rollins. He of course couldn't get the fans to like Reigns, but it wasn't for lack of trying. And at the two most recent Wrestlemanias he has been doing that pretty well, another reason I don't buy into the notion that he dominates every Wrestlemania and we need to be tired of it. I could go back and list everyone he has ever put over like Batista, Benjamin, Ambrose, etc and all the people he hasn't like Punk, Sheamus, Booker, etc. I'm not going into that because I don't think it's relevant to where we are right now in 2018.

Messiah wrote:Daniel Bryan was ridiculously over long before Triple H's involvement, which is why Triple H got involved (the theme here is that the acts are hot, which leads to Triple H sticking his hand in it). You do realize that, right? Just about any evil authority figure could have filled his role and the results would have been the same.


No they wouldn't have. Would the build-up have been as good if it was just Bryan vs Randy Boreton or Bryan vs Bootista? At least name an alternative that would have actually been better than Triple H instead of constantly reverting to the claim that he just shouldn't have been there/sticks his nose into the latest hot angle just because. There wouldn't have been as much drama in Bryan's story if he was already put in the main event of Wreslemania 30 instead of having to go through Triple H first. (Which I might add was a great match). And while Bryan was over before that feud began, he was even more over when it ended, and I think Triple H played an important part in that. You can argue about how much or how little of a difference it made, but there was a difference.

Messiah wrote:it isn't so much that he beat Sting so much as the fact he was in the match with him to begin with. Nobody wanted to see Triple H vs Sting. Nobody at all. But it had to be Triple H because it is always Triple H.


There you go again. "Nobody" wanted to see the match - according to you. I can tell you one person who wanted to see it, it was the gentleman with the sailboat avatar. Who would have been a better opponent for Sting at Wrestlemania 31? Not Undertaker because his character at that point was still recovering from losing the Streak, and Sting's character wasn't ready for that match either. Having Sting debut by laying out the biggest heel in the company at that time immediately established him as a huge anti-authority babyface.

In closing, I understand why you and many others think Triple H is stale and needs to take a back seat. Hopefully my post clarifies why I don't think he's stale and why he's been more of a positive than a negative at Wrestlemania, especially in recent years. It's hard for him to get stale to me when he only wrestles once a year. If Cena wrestled once a year you can bet that his match would be a way bigger deal too. However Cena works more matches than all the other part timers combined, so he has had way more opportunities to put people over. Undertaker and Lesnar are examples of part-timers who I can get tired of, because they literally do the exact same thing every time they make an appearance.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby The Legend » Apr 11, '18, 4:56 am

@KaiserGlider

I'll take issue with two things you said. First, that it was the match of the night at WrestleMania. I disagree strongly, the Intercontinental Championship triple threat was the match of the night. Furthermore, I certainly didn't nor did many other people I know want that tag match to be the match of the night, that being match of the night wasn't right for the story and didn't do the most for Ronda's credability and introducing her to the audience.

You say a singles match between Ronda and Steph would have been worse, I disagree again with this sentiment. I think a singles match would have been much better. Ronda hits that flurry strikes she did on Steph, Steph rakes the eyes and tries to hit a flurry of her own, Ronda gets pissed, gets ahold of Steph and locks in the armbar. Ronda made her fame off 40 second fights in MMA, and against Steph a 40 second squash was exactly what it called for. The crowd gets exactly what it wants, the payoff and explodes. The match lasts under a minute and instead of ending at midnight the show ends closer to 11:30.
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Re: Angle/Rousey and HHH/Steph was surprisingly entertaining

Postby PorkChop » Apr 28, '18, 3:17 pm

On the topic of Triple H though, I haven't seen anyone mention how badass he looks lately. I'm really digging the shaved head with the beard. I remember when he cut his hair off a few years ago he has this shit back-combed perm thing for a while but right now he looks the best he has in years, imo.

Steph continues to get better with age as well. Whatever they're taking in the McMahon-Helmsley household, I want in.
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